EN DE
Check 35,000+ stocks against 26 valuation models and 37 quality factors
Data-driven stock valuation

Lecron Energy Saving Materials (300343) fair value: what the stock is really worth

As of Sep 24, 2026: fair value of Lecron Energy Saving Materials ¥0.54, price ¥5.33, upside -89.9%, quality 57 out of 100. Calculated from audited financials with 26 valuation models and 37 quality factors, updated daily.

  1. Fair value above price? No
  2. Good quality? Yes
  3. Add to watchlist

Basic Materials · CN · ISIN CNE100001K14

LE Thin data Sep 28, 2026

Lecron Energy Saving Materials

300343 · SHE

Stretched ValuationStrong overvaluation with only moderate quality.

!Fair value ¥0.5400 · Strongly overvalued (−89.9%)
!Quality 57/100
!Weak Growth (revenue 5y −1.5 %/yr)
!Thin margins · 3.9% net margin (TTM)
!Low debt · negative free cash flow
!Trails peers (3/12)
!Narrow moat 25/100
!Evidence only low, so the estimate is less certain
!Weak on past: 7 out of 100
!Weak on dividend: 1 out of 100

What runs behind every stock

69 individual criteria per stock, every one traceable See the method →

Price vs Fair Value

¥29.40 ¥2.75 Fair Value ¥0.5400 Apr 2021 Sep 2026

White line = price, green steps = our fair value per fiscal year, dashed = 300-day average. As of Sep 28, 2026.

How to read this chart

60‑month range ¥2.75 – ¥29.40 · fair‑value band ¥0.3800 – ¥0.7100 · the ¥5.33 price screens above the ¥0.5400 fair value. Green steps = our fair value per fiscal year (point-in-time, no hindsight). 2 fiscal years are left out: there the valuation rested on only a fraction of the usual models. Dashed = 300-day average. As of Sep 28, 2026.

Follow Lecron Energy Saving Materials in your weekly email

Every Wednesday you see whether Lecron Energy Saving Materials is on track or worth a review, plus price against fair value. Free, up to 3 stocks.

We send you a confirmation link. Unsubscribe with one click.

Which stocks are undervalued right now? Check free Discover now →

Company profile

Lecron Industrial Development Group Co., Ltd. engages in the research, development, production, and sales of polyurethane and fluorochemical products in China and internationally. The company offers fluoropolymers, polyurethanes, and polyester.

Show more

Lecron Industrial Development Group Co., Ltd. engages in the research, development, production, and sales of polyurethane and fluorochemical products in China and internationally. The company offers fluoropolymers, polyurethanes, and polyester. It also provides polyurethane new materials, fourth-generation refrigerants and foaming agents, new fluoropolymers, and fine chemicals. The company was formerly known as Lecron Internet Media Industry Co., Ltd. and changed its name to Lecron Industrial Development Group Co., Ltd. in July 2019. Lecron Industrial Development Group Co., Ltd. was founded in 2003 and is headquartered in Zibo, China.

Stock analysis

Lecron Energy Saving Materials (300343) currently trades at ¥5.33, while our model-based Fair Value estimate is ¥0.5400, implying the stock looks roughly 887.2% overvalued today.

Show more

Valuation

Bull case: the Asset-Based group reads highest at a median of ¥1.22 per share, and 0 of the 13 models we run sit above the ¥5.33 price.

Bear case: the Earnings-Based group reads lowest at ¥0.3400, and 13 of the 13 models stay below the price. Evidence for this calculation is low.

Scenario range: ¥0.3800 (bear) to ¥0.7100 (bull), the price of ¥5.33 sits above it. Bear and bull are the same models on cautious and optimistic assumptions, a range, not a price target.

Quality & growth

The Quality Score stands at 57/100 (solid quality), in the Basic Materials sector.

Weak Growth: Revenue growth is inconsistent: the periods point in different directions, so there is no trend to rely on.

Lecron Energy Saving Materials reported revenue of 999M CNY in FY2025 versus 1.8B CNY in FY2021, a compound −14.1%/yr. Reported net income was 39.1M CNY in FY2025, compounding −39.3%/yr from FY2021.

Key figures

Market cap 7.0B CNY (≈ $1.0B) · P/E ratio 133.3 · P/S ratio 5.21 · EPS (TTM) ¥0.0400 · Dividend yield 0.0% · Net margin 3.9% · Return on equity 1.8% · Return on assets (EBIT) 10.1%.

Competitive moat

Our AI-assisted moat analysis scores the competitive advantage at 37 out of 100 (low confidence).

What moves the price

The share trades about 27% below its 52-week high and 13% above its 52-week low, currently below its 200-day average.

For context, the median of 10 Basic Materials peers we cover trades at −25% fair-value upside, at −90%, 300343 screens richer than that median.

Fair Value models

The price assumes far more growth than our models allow for, so the models scatter widely (¥0.0300 to ¥1.22). Read the Fair Value as a cautious anchor, not a price target; the Growth Forecast section shows what the price assumes.
Bear ¥0.3800 Fair Value ¥0.5400 Bull ¥0.7100
Model ⓘEach model values the company its own way (discounted cash flow, earnings, assets, dividends). The fair value above is their evidence-weighted blend, not the output of a single model. Based on fiscal year 2025 figures (about 9 months old). Earnings retained since then (¥0.0297 per share) are deliberately not added. Bear ⓘBear = the cautious scenario: the same model computed with conservative anchors (lower growth, margins and valuation multiples). Together with Bull it frames a plausible valuation range, not a price target.BaseBull ⓘBull = the optimistic scenario: the same model computed with favourable anchors (higher growth, margins and valuation multiples). Together with Bear it frames a plausible valuation range, not a price target. If a model's bull case is above four times its base value, the table shows that limit with a > sign (like the overall Bull above): beyond it no assumption holds. Evidence ⓘEvidence = how well-backed THIS model's estimate is for this stock (0–100): how complete and reliable its input data are, and how well the model fits the company. The final Fair Value is an evidence-weighted blend, so better-evidenced models count more. Green ≥70, amber 50–69, grey below 50.
Highest evidence
Owner Earnings ¥0.8500 ¥1.22 ¥1.74 77
Residual Income ¥1.20 ¥1.09 ¥1.06 76
Gordon GGM ¥0.0200 ¥0.0300 ¥0.0400 68
All 13 models by family
DCF Models
Owner Earnings ¥0.8500 ¥1.22 ¥1.74 77
Earnings-Based
Graham-Dodd ¥0.2500 ¥0.9800 ¥1.32 64
Lynch FV ¥0.2400 ¥0.3400 ¥0.4500 61
PEG = 1.0 ¥0.2400 ¥0.3400 ¥0.4500 57
Dividend Discount
Gordon GGM ¥0.0200 ¥0.0300 ¥0.0400 68
DDM Multi-Stage ¥0.0200 ¥0.0300 ¥0.0300 67
Multiples
P/E Multiple ¥0.4700 ¥0.6200 ¥0.7800 63
P/S Multiple ¥0.4700 ¥0.6200 ¥0.7800 58
P/B Multiple ¥0.4700 ¥0.6200 ¥0.7800 55
EV/EBITDA ¥0.7400 ¥0.9200 ¥1.09 67
Asset-Based
NCAV (Graham) ¥0.9100 ¥1.22 ¥1.82 54
Economic Profit
Residual Income ¥1.20 ¥1.09 ¥1.06 76
Growth Earnings
Growth-Adj P/E ¥0.3800 ¥0.5400 ¥0.7100 67

Open the full fair value analysis →

Notify me when 300343 reaches fair value

Put 300343 on your watchlist. We get in touch as soon as price and fair value meet or the trend turns.

Set up alert →

Quality Score breakdown

Overall quality 57/100

Of which business quality 54 · Market factors (momentum, volatility) 38

Profitability 21
Margins and returns on capital today
Quality Growth 56
Are margins and returns improving?
Cashflow 7
Earnings quality: real cash, not paper profit
Fin. Strength 82
Balance sheet, leverage, solvency risk
Investment 94
Disciplined investing over empire-building
Low Volatility 66
Calm price path (market factor)
Momentum 26
Price trend over the last 3–12 months (market factor)
52W Momentum 27
Distance to the 52-week high (market factor)
Net Issuance 99
Share count: buybacks or dilution?

Open the full quality analysis →

Revenue & earnings trend

Growth Quality ⓘGrowth is valuable only when reinvestment earns attractive returns (Aswath Damodaran): sustainable growth depends on return on capital, reinvestment and efficiency. Basis: total company revenue over the periods shown on the cards (3Y/5Y/all years), not per share, so a merger can show up as a growth jump; per-share earnings growth is in the value-creation card. 21/100
Revenue growth is inconsistent: the periods point in different directions, so there is no trend to rely on.
Revenue growth 1 year
+15.0%
Revenue growth 3 years ⓘMeasures the company's TOTAL revenue from reported annual statements: compound average growth per year (CAGR) from the fiscal year 3, 5 or N years back to the most recent comparable fiscal year. Not per share: buybacks do not change this number, and a merger can appear as a growth jump. Per-share growth (which does include buybacks) is in the value-creation card.
−21.5%
Revenue growth 5 years ⓘMeasures the company's TOTAL revenue from reported annual statements: compound average growth per year (CAGR) from the fiscal year 3, 5 or N years back to the most recent comparable fiscal year. Not per share: buybacks do not change this number, and a merger can appear as a growth jump. Per-share growth (which does include buybacks) is in the value-creation card.
−1.5%
Start year 2020 (pandemic). Over 10 years: +0.3% a year
Revenue growth 17 years ⓘMeasures the company's TOTAL revenue from reported annual statements: compound average growth per year (CAGR) from the fiscal year 3, 5 or N years back to the most recent comparable fiscal year. Not per share: buybacks do not change this number, and a merger can appear as a growth jump. Per-share growth (which does include buybacks) is in the value-creation card.
+11.0%
What shareholders gained per year (last 5 years) (mathematically smoothed) ⓘWhat the business itself delivers per year: earnings growth per share plus the dividend yield. This is what you get IF the market keeps valuing the stock the same way: it contains no assumption about the market changing its mind. Computed per share, so buybacks count and a merger does not pass as growth. For a company that pays no dividend it is pure earnings growth per share. Period: earnings growth per share as CAGR over the last 5 reported fiscal years (annual statements), plus the current dividend yield. The start value is the median of the three years around the start, so a single crisis year (a pandemic or a write-down) does not distort the rate. Smoothed = median of all growth paths between the years of the window (trend line on the logarithm of earnings per share): a single extreme year cannot distort the rate. The reported figure stays in the tooltip.
−48.3%
Earnings growth per share plus dividend.
Earnings per share, growth per year−48.3%
Dividend (yield on the price)0.0%
Pace: 5 vs 10 years ⓘTwo data points, not a trend model: earnings growth per share over the last 5 fiscal years against the last 10. Labelled "steady" when both rates are within 3 percentage points of each other, otherwise picking up or flattening. Shown only when ten years of history exist.−31.9% vs −1.9%, slowing
Profit margin 2020 to 2025 ⓘOperating margin then vs now, from reported annual statements. A falling margin after a boom year is the classic peak-earnings signal: the growth rate then leans on an inflated base.−30% → 0%
2025 sits 82% above its own trend. The rate follows the median trend of the last 5 years, not that single year.
Start year 2020 (pandemic)
⚠ Revenue per share shrinking 2.5%/yr over ~10Y (margins eroding too) ⓘStructural-decline marker: revenue PER SHARE has fallen over the last decade (robust median trend, not a single year). Backtested across 2005 to 2017, such businesses trailed the market by about 2.5 percentage points per year. Display only: it does not change the fair value or the quality score.

300343 screens 887% overvalued. Compare with Ningxia Baofeng Energy Group →

Compare Lecron Energy Saving Materials with another stock

Price, fair value, quality and upside side by side.

Free, no sign-up

Peer GroupⓘHow this stock ranks against its industry: the green marker is this stock, the band is the typical 25–75% peer range, and the tick is the median.Chemicals · 347 stocks

Beats the industry median on 3/12 measures
Overall it trails its industry peers.
Valuation
Quality Score 57 · Above median
Fair Value upside −89.9% · Bottom 25%
Profitability
Return on equity (TTM) 1.8% · Below median
Return on assets −0.4% · Bottom 25%
Net margin (TTM) 3.9% · Below median
Operating margin (TTM) 3.2% · Below median
Growth and dividend
Revenue growth 60.3% · Top 25%
Dividend yield (TTM) 0.0% · Bottom 25%
Balance sheet
Debt / equity 0.01× · Lowest 25%

Valuation Multiplesvs Chemicals median · lower = cheaper

P/E (TTM) 133.3× · Priciest 25%
P/B 3.61× · Priciest 25%
P/S (TTM) 6.42× · Priciest 25%

Strength profile in five axes (Snowflake)

VALUEFUTUREPASTHEALTHDIVIDEND
This stock
VALUEFUTUREPASTHEALTHDIVIDEND
Sector peers
VALUE (fair-value potential)0 · sector 2
FUTURE (revenue growth)100 · sector 33
PAST (return on equity)7 · sector 19
HEALTH (low debt)99 · sector 94
DIVIDEND (yield)1 · sector 32

VALUE 0: the price sits above our fair-value range.

Context: sector, industry, market

Values & ESG

Does this company touch areas you may want to avoid? The classification is inferred from sector and industry.

None of the checked exposures detected

Similar stocks

10 more Chemicals stocks, each showing price versus our Fair Value estimate.

Stock Price Fair Value vs Fair Value
Ningxia Baofeng Energy Group 600989 ¥22.33 ¥40.44 +81%
Dow Inc DOW $28.02 $20.98 −25%
Hengli Petrochemical Co 600346 ¥16.15 ¥43.28 +168%
Zangge Mining Company 000408 ¥71.46 ¥78.61 +10%
LG Chem, Ltd 051910 252,500 KRW 587,755 KRW +133%
Zhejiang Juhua Co 600160 ¥33.97 ¥19.25 −43%
Jiangsu Eastern Shenghong Co 000301 ¥13.36 ¥3.06 −77%
Formosa Chemicals & Fibre Corporation 1326 67.00 TWD 17.68 TWD −74%
Syensqo SA SYENS €78.20 €32.87 −58%
PETRONAS Chemicals Group 5183 4.49 MYR 1.51 MYR −66%

Explore undervalued stocks

More undervalued Basic Materials stocks →

Try a ready-made strategy

Pick a strategy and jump into the live analysis with that exact screen applied.

🥇 Backtested Best 🏆 Big Names ⭐ Top Rated 💎 Quality on Sale 🚀 Profitable Growth 🧊 Quality Compounders 💵 Dividend Stars 📈 Strong Momentum 📉 Fallen Angels ⚖️ Deeply Undervalued 🔍 Small-Cap Gems 🏰 Moat at a Fair Price 💼 Insider Buying 🎩 Buffett-Style Quality 📚 Peter Lynch GARP 🧮 Greenblatt Magic Formula 🛡️ Graham Defensive

Discover tools

For bloggers & editors: embed code + live data

For bloggers, editors and developers: paste this into your site or blog (a “Custom HTML” block in WordPress), it shows the current fair value and links back here. Free, plain HTML, and welcome. Full data streams (CSV/JSON) at /developers.

Cite: Fair Value Calculator (2026). "Lecron Energy Saving Materials Fair Value". https://www.fairvalue-calculator.com/stock/300343

Frequently asked questions

Is Lecron Energy Saving Materials (300343) overvalued or undervalued?
As of Sep 28, 2026, our model estimates a fair value of ¥0.5400 versus a price of ¥5.33, about −90% upside (overvalued).
What is the fair value of 300343?
Our model-based fair value for Lecron Energy Saving Materials is ¥0.5400 (as of Sep 28, 2026), built from audited fundamentals. The current price: ¥5.33.
What is the quality score of 300343?
Lecron Energy Saving Materials has a Quality Score of 57/100. It measures business quality (profitability, growth, cash flow, balance-sheet strength, investment discipline, share issuance). Market factors such as price momentum and volatility do not enter the number; they are shown separately in the detail view.
What is the price target for Lecron Energy Saving Materials (300343)?
Our model-based price target is the fair value of ¥0.5400 (as of Sep 28, 2026) from 13 valuation models. Cautious scenario ¥0.3800, optimistic scenario ¥0.7100. It is a calculation from audited fundamentals, not an analyst target.
What is the Lecron Energy Saving Materials stock forecast for 2026?
Our models put fair value at ¥0.5400, about −90% upside versus a price of ¥5.33 (overvalued). Cautious scenario ¥0.3800, optimistic scenario ¥0.7100. The calculation is refreshed regularly with new filings.
What is the revenue of Lecron Energy Saving Materials (300343)?
Lecron Energy Saving Materials reported trailing-twelve-month revenue of about 1.1B CNY (latest available figure, as of Sep 28, 2026).
Does Lecron Energy Saving Materials pay a dividend?
Lecron Energy Saving Materials currently shows a dividend yield of about 0.03% relative to its recent price (as of Sep 28, 2026).
What is the intrinsic value of Lecron Energy Saving Materials (300343)?
Intrinsic value and fair value mean the same thing: what the business is worth on its numbers, independent of the share price. For Lecron Energy Saving Materials it is ¥0.5400 per share (as of Sep 28, 2026), against a price of ¥5.33. It is the blended result of 13 valuation models (cash flow, earnings, asset, dividend).
Is Lecron Energy Saving Materials stock overvalued or undervalued in 2026?
As of Sep 28, 2026, 300343 trades above its calculated fair value: price ¥5.33, fair value ¥0.5400, a gap of about −90% (overvalued). The calculation is refreshed with each new quarterly report, so the verdict can change during the year.
Is fair value the same as the market price of 300343?
No. The price is what the market pays today (¥5.33); the fair value is what the company's own numbers justify (¥0.5400). For Lecron Energy Saving Materials the two are ¥4.79 per share apart. That gap is exactly why we show both numbers side by side.
How much is Lecron Energy Saving Materials worth?
The market values Lecron Energy Saving Materials at about 7.0B CNY (market capitalisation, as of Sep 28, 2026). Per share that is ¥5.33; our models calculate a fair value of ¥0.5400 per share.
What do the bullish and bearish scenarios say about 300343?
Our models span a range for Lecron Energy Saving Materials: cautious scenario ¥0.3800, base ¥0.5400, optimistic ¥0.7100 per share (as of Sep 28, 2026, price ¥5.33). The range comes from different growth and margin assumptions, not from analyst opinions.
What is the P/E ratio of 300343?
Lecron Energy Saving Materials trades at a price-to-earnings ratio of 133.3 (as of Sep 28, 2026). A P/E on its own says little: it compares the price with ONE year of profit, while our fair value of ¥0.5400 is built from several models across several years. Other multiples: P/B 3.6, P/S 6.4.
How solid is the balance sheet of Lecron Energy Saving Materials (300343)?
Balance-sheet figures for Lecron Energy Saving Materials (as of Sep 28, 2026): return on equity 1.8%, debt of 0.01 per unit of equity. They feed the Quality Score of 57/100, which measures business quality independently of the share price.
How far is 300343 from its 52-week high?
Lecron Energy Saving Materials trades at ¥5.33, about 27% below its 52-week high of ¥7.29 and 13% above the low of ¥4.73 (as of Sep 24, 2026). Distance from the high says nothing about value: that is what the fair value of ¥0.5400 is for.
Which stocks are comparable to Lecron Energy Saving Materials?
From the same area (Basic Materials) we also value Ningxia Baofeng Energy Group, Dow Inc, Hengli Petrochemical Co, Zangge Mining Company, among others. Each of them has its own fair-value calculation on this site using the same models, so the comparison is like for like.
Is Lecron Energy Saving Materials stock attractive at the current price?
The data as of Sep 28, 2026: price ¥5.33, calculated fair value ¥0.5400 (−90%), Quality Score 57/100, from 13 models. Whether that fits your horizon and risk tolerance is your call. We provide the calculation, not investment advice.
How is the fair value of 300343 calculated?
We run Lecron Energy Saving Materials through 13 models from four families: discounted cash flow, earnings models, asset and balance-sheet models, and dividend models. Every model gets the same audited fundamentals; the result is the weighted average of ¥0.5400, with the spread shown as a cautious and an optimistic scenario.
Is it still worth investing in stocks now?
The global stock market currently sits 16.1 % above its aggregate fair value. Lecron Energy Saving Materials itself currently trades above fair value. An expensive market is no reason to stay out and no reason to buy everything at once: keep a broad savings plan running, buy single stocks only with money you can do without, and hold part of your money liquid while the market is high. The full picture including sectors is on is it worth investing now.
What is the share price of Lecron Energy Saving Materials (300343)?
The closing price on Sep 24, 2026 was ¥5.33. Our model-based fair value is ¥0.5400, about −90% upside (overvalued). We carry closing prices from our data provider, not a live tick.
What should I pay attention to with Lecron Energy Saving Materials right now?
The price sits above even our optimistic bull case (¥0.7100). The favourable scenario is already priced in. The large gap to fair value rests on thin data (low evidence): fewer applicable models and a shorter history. Read it with extra caution. Solid but not exceptional quality (57/100) and above fair value, neither a clear bargain nor a standout compounder. A fairly wide model range (¥0.3800 to ¥0.7100) leaves room in how you read the outcome.
Where does the earnings growth of Lecron Energy Saving Materials (300343) come from?
Earnings per share at Lecron Energy Saving Materials grew +16.8 % a year from 2013 to 2024. Broken into its drivers: revenue per share −0.1 %, EBIT margin +20.2 %, tax rate +0.9 %, residual (interest, one-offs) −3.6 %. The four rates multiply to the earnings growth rate, they do not add up. Start and end are three-year averages so a single exceptional year does not distort the result.

Key figures of Lecron Energy Saving Materials

How large is the market capitalisation of Lecron Energy Saving Materials (300343)?
The market capitalisation of Lecron Energy Saving Materials is 7.0B CNY (≈ $1.0B). The stock-market value of the whole company: share price times number of shares. It is what the market asks for the entire business today.
What is the P/S ratio of Lecron Energy Saving Materials (300343)?
The price-to-sales ratio of Lecron Energy Saving Materials is 5.21 (P/E × margin). Price to sales: market value relative to yearly revenue. Useful when profit is thin or distorted.
What are the earnings per share of Lecron Energy Saving Materials (300343)?
Earnings per share at Lecron Energy Saving Materials are ¥0.0400 (price ÷ EPS = P/E 133.3). Earnings per share over the last twelve months: total profit spread across every single share.
What is the dividend yield of Lecron Energy Saving Materials (300343)?
The dividend yield of Lecron Energy Saving Materials is 0.0% (payout 4.2%). Yearly dividend relative to the share price. 3% pays 3 per 100 invested. Below: how much of profit is used for it.
What is the net margin of Lecron Energy Saving Materials (300343)?
The net margin of Lecron Energy Saving Materials is 3.9% (fiscal year 2025). How much of every unit of revenue ends up as profit. 10% means 10 cents of profit per dollar of sales.
What is the return on equity of Lecron Energy Saving Materials (300343)?
The return on equity (ROE) of Lecron Energy Saving Materials is 1.8% (last twelve months). Profit relative to shareholders' equity, how efficiently the company works with its owners' money.
What is the EBIT return on assets of Lecron Energy Saving Materials (300343)?
On an EBIT basis the return on assets of Lecron Energy Saving Materials is 10.1% (avg 5y). Operating profit (EBIT) relative to everything the company owns, as a multi-year average. It describes the business model rather than one good or bad year.
What is the operating margin of Lecron Energy Saving Materials (300343)?
The operating margin of Lecron Energy Saving Materials is 3.2% (last twelve months). Profit from the core business (before interest and taxes) relative to revenue.
How fast is revenue growing at Lecron Energy Saving Materials (300343)?
Revenue at Lecron Energy Saving Materials is growing +60.3% versus a year earlier (3y avg −21.5%). How much revenue grew versus a year earlier (YoY). The 3-year average next to it puts the single year in context.
How fast are earnings growing at Lecron Energy Saving Materials (300343)?
Earnings per share at Lecron Energy Saving Materials are growing +61.7% versus a year earlier. How much earnings per share grew versus a year earlier.
How much free cash flow does Lecron Energy Saving Materials (300343) generate?
The free cash flow of Lecron Energy Saving Materials is −32.5M CNY (fiscal year 2025). The cash truly left after running and investing in the business, this is what pays dividends and buybacks.
How much net cash does Lecron Energy Saving Materials (300343) hold?
Lecron Energy Saving Materials holds more cash than debt, 153M CNY net (fiscal year 2024). The company holds more cash than debt, a safety cushion.
Free · no account needed

Watch Lecron Energy Saving Materials in the live analysis

One click puts Lecron Energy Saving Materials on your watchlist: fair value and trend at a glance, plus comparison, the diversification check and the 35,000+ stock screener. You can also try 14 days of Pro there, no card.

Watch for free →

Zero risk: nothing is ever charged. Your watchlist is yours, with or without an account.